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(How Do You Get a 6Hit?: new section)
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People still thinking +1 stp is +.1 tp even tho 450 delay sam with +46 stp gets 16.7 tp per hit, and 16.9 at +47 stp, was the reason he asked for a bit of clarification.--[[User:Charles Guillen|Charles Guillen]] 00:37, September 22, 2009 (UTC)
 
People still thinking +1 stp is +.1 tp even tho 450 delay sam with +46 stp gets 16.7 tp per hit, and 16.9 at +47 stp, was the reason he asked for a bit of clarification.--[[User:Charles Guillen|Charles Guillen]] 00:37, September 22, 2009 (UTC)
  +
  +
== How Do You Get a 6Hit? ==
  +
  +
The end goal for each SAM should be acquiring a 6hit setup. This allows a WS everytime you land 6 hits, without wasting a lot of additional TP and time, over 100%. Many endgame linkshells require this, as there is serious concern regarding "feeding TP" to Notorious Monsters, and so big damage + low number of hits, is the preferred method of dealing damage. 6Hit setup allows you to do this.
  +
  +
Finding out how to make your own Delay * sTP build can be done by some research, but in an effort to make it a little easier for people, here it is.
  +
  +
'''6Hit:'''
  +
  +
75SAM
  +
  +
5/5 StoreTP Merit
  +
  +
[[Hagun]] (450 delay)
  +
  +
[[Brutal Earring]]
  +
  +
[[Askar Korazin]]
  +
  +
[[Rajas Ring]]
  +
  +
This setup will give you 102%TP upon landing your 6th strike, without sacrificing slots with gear that doesnt have very good stats but has StoreTP.
  +
  +
  +
If those items are out of your reach (in which case you may not be in an HNM shell, but perhaps you still want to have a 6hit), the end formula is basically:
  +
  +
75SAM
  +
  +
5/5 StoreTP Merits
  +
  +
a 450 delay Great Katana(like [[Onimaru]] is a generally accepted choice)
  +
  +
+11 StoreTP through gear
  +
  +
+11 StoreTP can be attained by using:
  +
  +
[[Shinimusha Haidate]] +6 (common use for this slot is [[Byakko's Haidate]])
  +
  +
[[Hachiman Sune-Ate]] +5 (common use for this slot is [[Fuma Sune-Ate]])
  +
  +
This setup is designed for beginners, sacrifices stats in some slots, however it is the least worst of your choices, and offers all AuctionHouse attainable gear at a reasonable cost.
  +
[[Hachiman Kote]] is often at first glance something people go for, but using that piece of gear doent allow you to use [[Dusk Gloves]], and Dusk gloves are much better than HachiKote. So if you have to lose a Haste-slot, the Fuma-Haste feet are the best alternative for that. People who normally use HachiKote, also combine it with a [[Rose Strap]], obtaining the required 6Hit storeTP requirements, but sacrificing Haste, Attack, and Double-Attack to do that(also it stops you from WS-swapping in +STR gigas bracelets). This kind of setup would receive criticism.
  +
  +
  +
At the end of the day you just need to have +11StoreTP and you will WS every 6 hits. How you set that up is your choice as there are certain ways to optimize it.
  +
  +
--[[User:Malitia|Malitia]] 19:41, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

Revision as of 19:41, December 22, 2009

I just did some testing:

Maneater (delay 276):

BST75/WHM37: 7.2TP/hit
+Carbonara:  7.6TP/hit (+6%)
BST75/SAM29: 7.9TP/hit (+10%)

Plantreaper (delay 480):

BST75/WHM37: 12.0TP/hit
+Carbonara:  12.7TP/hit (+6%)
BST75/SAM29: 13.2TP/hit (+10%)
+Carbonara:  13.9TP/hit (+16%)

Before you read all these theories on Store TP. remember this. If you can wear Haste in a armor slot instead of Store TP. DO IT... Haste > Store TP. heres a simple way to put it. 20% haste is fairly easy to get on SAM. that means for every 5 swings you do you will have done 1 extra swing in there cause of your 20% haste. 1 swing = 17 TP which is equal to 170 store TP since store TP 10 = 1% more TP on a swing. Keep in mind that Store TP is cumulative in that it activates every swing. It would take in armor Store TP 35 minimum or greater to equal the TP gain of haste+20%. but remember with haste its a extra attack not just extra TP. so in the end you do a lot more damage with Haste gear and would accomplish the same or better TP gain. Store TP is great for the armor slots where haste doesn't exist or where you don't have the haste armor yet. Or great for Ranger being that Haste does not affect Ranged attack speed.


All calculations are based on building up to 300TP by hitting a mob, charming and releasing so it never hits me back. It seems that TP gain is only calculated to 0.1 TP precision; I never saw a pattern longer than 10 hits.

As the article says, the Store TP trait from my SAM29 sub gives a 10% bonus to TP gain. However, the Carbonara seems to be giving Store TP+6 rather than the expected +4.


The most useful amounts of Store TP are those that will get you to 100 TP in fewer hits. A SAM75 with a 450 delay Great Katana gets 14.1 TP (11.3+25%) per hit; 7 hits make 98.7 TP, not quite enough.

Adding Store TP+2 in equipment or food brings this up to 14.3 (11.3+27%) TP per hit, or 100.1 TP in 7 hits.

Getting down to 6 hits for 100 TP requires a serious focus on Store TP equipment; you need Store TP+23 from gear and food. One way to get this is with Hachiman body, hands, legs, feet and an Attila's Earring. Getting an HQ of any of the Hachiman pieces would allow you to drop the earring.

UPDATE: After the April 2006 TP update, a 450 delay GKT gets 11.5 TP per hit, or 14.3 at SAM75 with no +Store TP. Getting down to 6 hits takes Store TP +20. Later update: The poster below is correct, it should be +21.

Other jobs can also use Store TP equipment and food to reduce the number of hits to 100 TP, though their options are more limited. A 504-delay Great Axe such as the Martial Bhuj gives 12.3TP per hit, or 98.4TP per 8 hits. Store TP+2 boosts this to 12.5TP per hit, or 100TP per 8 hits. Rajas Ring would cover this, or Brutal Earring + Attila's Earring, or two Attila's Earrings.

Store TP+5 from Rajas Ring is also enough to get 100TP in 8 hits from a 480 delay scythe or Great Sword. Store TP+6 (Rajas+Brutal) is enough for a 470 delay weapon. The 528 delay scythes and 444 delay GS don't need any Store TP; they already give just over 100TP in 8 and 9 hits, respectively.

A WAR/NIN or BST/NIN Dual Wielding two 276-delay axes gets 6.2TP per hit (7.2/1.15), or 99.2TP in 16 hits. Store TP+2 bumps it up to 6.3TP per hit, or 100.8TP in 16 hits. Or they could just replace one with a 288-delay axe, which gives 6.5TP per hit without any Store TP.

--Valyana 18:51, 8 Feb 2006 (PST)

Valyana I can tell you for a fact that a level 75 SAM (using a 450 delay weapon) who has TP merits + TP gear that totals 20 will not get 100% TP, he will get 99TP (over six hits). And yes that full-timeing Store TP+20 (including WSs). If per chance a double-attack proced on the WS and gave him 1 extra TP, then yes 20 would be enough, but your talking about an activation rate of 0-31% (can you have 31% on SAM? or is 26% the highest?) depending on gear/food setup. So to all you fresh SAMs out there, you need to full time Store TP+21 to have a 6hit build.
5.0+[(450-180)*6.5)]/270 = 11.5 BaseTP
11.5 * (1 + .46) = 16.7 (you need to drop any digits past the tenths digit)
16.7 * 6 = 100.2TP
I must also point out: If you want to WS in only your Rajas Ring and Brutal earring and you have 5/5 TP merits. Then you must have Store TP+46 (that +10 from merits and +12 from gear and +25 from Store TP IV) for all your "normal" hits. This will allow you to stack STR+Atk for your WS without having to stay in your full Store TP gear set.
11.5 * (1 + .41) = 16.2 (WS TP)
11.5 * (1 + .46) = 16.8 (normal attack TP) (16.79 round up to 16.8 [tested])
16.2 + 16.8 * 5 = 100.2
LOL 5 hit gear set just for fun...
11.5 * (1 + .74) = 20.0 * 5 = 100TP
(That's +25 from Store TP IV +10 from merits and LOL + 39 from gear)
(Yes this is technically possible (but just silly), I believe the max a SAM can have for Store TP is +64 from gear/food. (That's 99 all together.)
5 hit gear set with Rajas + Brutal for WS
11.5 * (1 + .41) = 16.2 (WS TP)
11.5 * (1 + .83) = 21.0 ("normal" attack TP)
16.2 + 21 * 4 = 100.2
While technically possible your accuracy and damage for normal swings would suffer so badly that any extra damage you do from WSing more often would be lost.
4 Hit build?!?!!?!
The Futsuno Mitama has a base TP of 13.0
13.0 * (1 + .93) = 25.0 * 4 = 100TP!.... good luck with that, LOL

p.s. the hundreth digit is not always floored (rounded down), I'm not sure what happens when .05 happens, does it get rounded up or down?

--AnonRamuh 06:11, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

BLU Trait info

For Blue Mage, does anyone know yet what the trait be, in terms of Store TP I, II, III, or IV? I would think, because it's at such a high level, it'd be either III or IV, but one can't be too sure, you know?
Snojoex 12:10, 8 May 2006 (PDT)

It's Store TP1. Most BLU traits besides Clear Mind is level 1 only. Petco 22:52, 29 June 2007 (CDT)
What happens to BLU/SAM? He gets Store TP2 by SAM Job Trait and Store TP1 by BLU Job Trait, does it cumulate? --Elvaron 14:13, 12 June 2008 (UTC)
My guess is no, since other examples such as Clear Mind and Defense Bonus do not allow cumulative bonuses to the same level. Only the highest level of the trait in question would prevail. Can anybody capable of BLU/SAM verify this just in case? --Jeff 13:10, 20 June 2008 (UTC)
BLU75 and SAM75 here, just checked and, no, it does not cumulate. with /SAM, it's plain ol' Store TP II. The set job trait from BLU spells gets nullified. --MyQueensKnight 17:03, 12 May 2009 (UTC)

Cap?

There is either no cap or it has been raised. 25 (trait) + 8 (merits) + 34 (gear) on a 450 delay GK yields an expected 19.2 tp per swing, and I stepped outside Jeuno and tested it, and it worked perfectly. Go and try it yourself if you don't believe me. Also, if there is a cap, I have a feeling that COR's buff doesn't count toward it, or counts separately. Have not tested it yet personally, however. Edit: Oh, I misunderstood what the below poster had said, and realize they mean +51 not counting the trait, or so I assume. This should be made clear on the main page. --NadulPandy 19:01, 27 August 2009 (UTC)

is there a cap? i think SAM75 can possibly get up to ~225% base tp rate iirc. --Kerah 01:52, 15 October 2008 (UTC)

Store TP caps at +51, not +50... I did tests with my gear merits and food I had a total Store TP of 77
my tp should've gone 20.3, 40.6, 60.9, 81.2, 101.5 (total 77(+52))
but it went 20.2, 40.4, 60.6, 80.8, 101 (Total 76 (+51))
it if was (Total 75(+50)).. it would be 20.1, 40.2, 60.3, 80.4, 100.5 etc etc
mob did NOT hit me, seigan third eye, and Zanshin did NOT proc 5/5 store tp merits, and no they dont increase cap. why +51?! go look at haste :) you really need +26 haste to get the +25 cap Sanjuro asura 01:51, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

  • This suggests the 10 Store TP from merits would NOT count as a bonus to the job trait, but against your gear cap. If it was a bonus to the job trait, which is what is assumed normally, you'd cap out at 86 Store TP with 51 Store TP from the gear/food/etc. I think this definitely needs more testing, especially with enough Store TP to break into the 21 TP per hit zone since all of your numbers are fractions above 20 and with the same net 101 at the end...just sayin'... Gregedor 08:40, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
  • On your analogy to the haste cap, the 26 haste is a cap for 25% actual haste because of how the game handles fractions (or at least how we think it does). Since the 1.XX modifier where XX is your Store TP seems to work for calculations, it would be more natural to surmise that the game caps your multiplier at some percentage. 50% or 75% boost would be two likely levels, but we know you can go beyond 50% so throw that out. It might be that 76 Store TP nets you a 75% boost, similar to haste, and that the cap is 175% of your normal TP/hit. If this is the case then 76 could be the actual cap due to all contributors (merits, job traits, gear, food) and not represent a 51 Store TP gear cap. COR seems to be above and beyond these calculations allowing you to essentially break the cap. Gregedor 08:40, 30 August 2009 (UTC)
  • I think far more testing is required on this now that there is actually enough Store TP in the game to reach these high levels. For those interested, there is a chart in my Samurai Guide that shows what Store TP is required for each build level for various delay weapons. Obviously these are mathmatical calculations, especially if there is any cap out there. Gregedor 08:40, 30 August 2009 (UTC)

Clarification

Increasing TP/hit by 1% DOES NOT mean increasing TP/hit by 1. There is a difference between a PERCENTAGE increase and a POINT increase. If someone can find a clear, distinct, and succinct way to add this to the wiki page, please do so. It's incredibly frustrating trying to convey this point. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Bsphil (talkcontribs).

I think the example on the page spells it out rather succinctly. --Chrisjander t/ c 04:01, 10 November 2008 (UTC)

You'd think so, but I see people misunderstanding the concept on a constant basis. --Bsphil 18:48, 21 July 2009 (UTC)

People still thinking +1 stp is +.1 tp even tho 450 delay sam with +46 stp gets 16.7 tp per hit, and 16.9 at +47 stp, was the reason he asked for a bit of clarification.--Charles Guillen 00:37, September 22, 2009 (UTC)

How Do You Get a 6Hit?

The end goal for each SAM should be acquiring a 6hit setup. This allows a WS everytime you land 6 hits, without wasting a lot of additional TP and time, over 100%. Many endgame linkshells require this, as there is serious concern regarding "feeding TP" to Notorious Monsters, and so big damage + low number of hits, is the preferred method of dealing damage. 6Hit setup allows you to do this.

Finding out how to make your own Delay * sTP build can be done by some research, but in an effort to make it a little easier for people, here it is.

6Hit:

75SAM

5/5 StoreTP Merit

Hagun (450 delay)

Brutal Earring

Askar Korazin

Rajas Ring

This setup will give you 102%TP upon landing your 6th strike, without sacrificing slots with gear that doesnt have very good stats but has StoreTP.


If those items are out of your reach (in which case you may not be in an HNM shell, but perhaps you still want to have a 6hit), the end formula is basically:

75SAM

5/5 StoreTP Merits

a 450 delay Great Katana(like Onimaru is a generally accepted choice)

+11 StoreTP through gear

+11 StoreTP can be attained by using:

Shinimusha Haidate +6 (common use for this slot is Byakko's Haidate)

Hachiman Sune-Ate +5 (common use for this slot is Fuma Sune-Ate)

This setup is designed for beginners, sacrifices stats in some slots, however it is the least worst of your choices, and offers all AuctionHouse attainable gear at a reasonable cost. Hachiman Kote is often at first glance something people go for, but using that piece of gear doent allow you to use Dusk Gloves, and Dusk gloves are much better than HachiKote. So if you have to lose a Haste-slot, the Fuma-Haste feet are the best alternative for that. People who normally use HachiKote, also combine it with a Rose Strap, obtaining the required 6Hit storeTP requirements, but sacrificing Haste, Attack, and Double-Attack to do that(also it stops you from WS-swapping in +STR gigas bracelets). This kind of setup would receive criticism.


At the end of the day you just need to have +11StoreTP and you will WS every 6 hits. How you set that up is your choice as there are certain ways to optimize it.

--Malitia 19:41, December 22, 2009 (UTC)

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