Category talk:Abyssea/Archive 1

This is an archive of previous discussions regarding the Category:Abyssea article.

Notice
This talk page has been cloned into Talk:Abyssea, to match the discussions on the new main Abyssea page. The page is now a category page, and no longer the main page. --SimuAndy 16:19, January 11, 2011 (UTC)

I've found that Murex aggro job abilites and Amoebans aggro spellcasting. However, this only seems to happen at night, specifically between the 18:00 and 6:00 time slot for each day. Additionally, I was trying to enter the maw in Valkurm Dunes with my Samurai (LV16) and found that the Maw gives no response message. I don't recall seeing a minimum level requirement to enter Abyssea, but I'm assuming there is one, most likely at 30+ if I recall mention in an update somewhere. Storme 02:04, September 27, 2010 (UTC)

ARTICLE IS BEING ABUSED
The main page is a  CATEGORY . However, it is being treated as a catch-all for Abyssea information - including Pyxis info. The page is getting to overwhelming. All of that stuff belongs in its own pages (some of which already exists). Nothing should be on a Category page except a general introduction, some links to the major related pages, and then a list of all pages with the category. Even this Discussion page has turned into a general Abyssea forum and is getting bulky.

Until the article is cleaned up, I have added a right-aligned TOC so that people can jump to what they are looking for. Please take care of the overkill that is Category:Abyssea! I will try to break up the information as well when time permits. --Abbydon 15:03, November 17, 2010 (UTC)


 * In my opinion, it looks very nice, but I agree, Pyxis info and other stuff should be in a different page. Fredjan.Phoenix 03:01, November 18, 2010 (UTC)
 * I don't dispute that it looks good, but it's a Category page. It should have an introduction and links to major related pages. It shouldn't have multiple, complete articles embedded in it. For an example of the brevity I'm talking about, look at this: Category:Missions. It has an overview of the category along with links to major topics. After that, the standard "Pages in..." section is accessible. Category:Abyssea is really massive. For a true test of the size of such pages, try browsing it with something like an iPhone. I just think that actual wiki articles should be made instead of using the Category page as a catch-all. 18:40, November 18, 2010 (UTC)

I will make an attempt at splitting out the various sections of the category reference page into their own articles, and prune down this page. I will then remove the #redirect at Abyssea and put the reference summary page there. I expect to finish this tonight (Monday, January 3rd, US Central time zone). --SimuAndy 14:02, January 3, 2011 (UTC)

Abyssea better in its own section?
From what I collected in my short visit to Abyssea, I do not think the thing fits the mission format.

First, it's a whole system of its own with unique rules, mechanics and features. Then, there's no actual "missions" (at least not from the start at least) but quests and objectives. For example, the current 4th mission in the list, A Goldstruck Gigas, is a La Theine quest. Furthermore, there's no real order since I opened three quests while in Tahrongi.

Therefore, I propose that Abyssea has its own section, moved to a more appropriate location or at the very least reformated to fit the nature of Abyssea. Nightshader~ 2010-06-22

I am reformating this page into something more traditional. Please change the categroy location to somewhere more fitting.

I believe we should rename this article for simply Abyssea. It seems this information will be general Abyssea stuff. ~Nightshader @2010-06-22

I agree, as there is too much ambiguity with the expansion data page ( Vision of Abyssea and the page with the (apparently) only quest. I'm going to export this page and import it as Category:Abyssea.  Tahngarthor talk-contribs 02:37, June 23, 2010 (UTC)

Thank you. In the meantime, I'll see if I can add the stuff I received while visiting Abyssea earlier. ~Nightshader @2010-06-22

Export/import complete. By the way please use four tildes to sign your comments. Don't manually type out your name. You can customize how your signature appears through your Preferences. Tahngarthor talk-contribs 02:57, June 23, 2010 (UTC)

Unverified claims
"*Monsters in Abyssea start out as unaggressive, but grow more and more resentful towards adventurers slaying their abyssean kin. One does not even have to kill that family to gain their resentment. One could kill a dozen lizards, and earn the ire of Efts. "

Where did we get this? I've killed dozens of lizards and a number of other mobs, and no lizard or sapling or other normally non-aggroing mob has aggro'd me. The only things I've gotten aggro from so far are Clionids, which aggro anyway even without killing anything else. Tahngarthor talk-contribs 08:01, June 26, 2010 (UTC)

Although I didn't put that in there, you kind of proved what he said in the post. For example, Clionids do not start off aggroing. I ran through tons of them for about 30 minutes with my cousin, killing them and looking for shiny ones and such. The fact that you killed lizards made the clionids aggro you I am guessing. Clionids did not start aggroing me until the next time I entered with more people. this was konchstat btw. There is still so much to be learned about aggro here so all of these theories could be entirely wrong. At the time, they seem to be the most accurate though.Markscp 06:20, June 27, 2010 (UTC)

Verified as untrue.. Ran thru Abyssea - Konschtat having only ever killed Limule and Clionid type mobs. the Spirit type mob, Dybbuk, did in fact aggro. Briag 04:48, June 28, 2010 (UTC)

NOT true, only Abyssea native mobs show strange aggro patterns, which often vary from Daytime to Night. Because of the lack of Celerity abyssites and Time Extensions (parties werent made apparent til two weeks into abbyssea) people overlooked vanadiel time and just decided Abby was different. They aggro what they aggro, if they dont aggro they dont aggro. That's that.

This "Abyssean Aggro Traits" is completely false. Clionids HP aggro, Limules Aggro spellcasting, Gigas aggro sight, Myconid types aggro sound, Pixies don't aggro. The portion about having certain glows changing aggro behavior is also false in my experience. Signing here to support removal of this section and fix the AA traits on mob tables.Tekniques 01:44, June 29, 2010 (UTC)
 * Had a Limules that I had some hate on chase me down when I had full HP, Sneak, Invis, and Deoderise on, either they have true sight sound or smell, or the light lets them track you. More testing would be required.--Duzell-Levi 02:47, July 3, 2010 (UTC)

A lot of fluff has been added by Teiei; I have not seen any verification about Viridian/Azure/Scarlet abyssite only working in their respective zone, and in some cases how would that even work (e.g. Azure Abyssite of Celerity which decreases Traverser Stone repop rate clearly is in effect all the time, not when in Abyssea-Konschtat). As such, I've removed such claims. If you're unsure about something, either ask on the discussion page, tag a verification or don't add it at all. Kegsay 12:07, July 14, 2010 (UTC)

Map Ownership
The maps I am posting which show where each enemy is located is not mine, I did not make it. The maps were made by Cairthenn, from bluegartls and can alternatively be found here: http://www.bluegartr.com/threads/95053-Abyssea-Discussion?p=3905962&viewfull=1#post3905962.Markscp 06:24, June 27, 2010 (UTC)

Key Items
Has anyone found anything involving whether or not the purchasable Key Items are permanent or temporary? I assume that the three listed from the Cruor Prospector are permanent due to their descriptions and costs, but knowing SE this could be wrong. Doluka 23:56, June 27, 2010 (UTC)

Yea, would like to know too. If they are permanent it will make a great diffrence for fights in Abyssea --Killercat Bis 17:22, July 5, 2010 (UTC)

Nobody has reported losing the key items even though they are listed as temporary key items. Krizz 14:55, July 20, 2010 (UTC)

i have obtained the following keyitems Ivory Abyssite of Sojourn, Ivory Abyssite of Confluence and Ivory Abyssite of Expertise, along with map of Abyssea - Tahrongi. i went out and came back in and i still have all keyitems, i conform they are permenant.--Namy 08:25, July 24, 2010 (UTC).

Things Carrying Over to Other Zones
Is Cruor universal to all Abyssea zones? Like gaining cruor in Abyssea-La Theine and spending it in Abyssea-Tahrongi? --HazelEyeDrops 22:43, June 28, 2010 (UTC)

Yes, you can gain cruor anywhere and spend it in any of the zones --Urth 22:51, June 28, 2010 (UTC)

This is also true of temporary items acquired within.

Stored time erased?
I noticed something odd this last time I went into Abyssea. The previous time I entered I had 117 minutes saved up and I had 3 stones on me. I used a little over 90 of those minutes and exited Abyssea. I immediately reentered Abyssea again and traded my 3 stones to store the time so I could pick up new stones. Fast forward to last night when I went in to Abyssea again expecting to have stored time + 2 stones. I had no stored time saved up.

I originally stored the time in Abyssea - La Theine and the second time I entered Abyssea - Konschtat where I noticed I didn't have the time I should have. I think there might have been a conquest update between the two times I entered but I'm not sure as I don't remember exact dates. I'm also not sure if the latest patch happened between me storing time and noticing it not there.

Has anyone else experienced a loss of time from stones already stored and if so, do any of the above situations apply to you as well?

--Mastershadow 01:17, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

This happened to me as well. I went to abyssea-tahrongi hoping to store up some more time (was gonna trade one stone to max out at 120 minutes) and I noticed I only had the option to request visitant status by using my one traverser stone and gaining 30 minutes. I was not given the option to set my visitant status to the time remianing, like I had done before when I stored time.

There was NOT a conquest tally between the last time I went to abyssea (indeed it is now Tuesday and I went Monday) and there was not a patch. Also, i had stored time in the same zone that I was attempting to add time to. No one else I have talked to has had this happen to them. Anyone else out there experiencing this?

--Divinian 12:26, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

Just checked after maintenance and I still have all my time. --Mastershadow 02:57, July 8, 2010 (UTC)

I currently have 46 minutes. I left to get some more stones. Re-entered and hoped I could trade some stones to bump up the time. The guy would only give me 3 min for 1 stone, 6 min for 2 stones and 9 minutes for 3 stones. --Razorcat 06:39, July 12, 2010 (UTC)

time still ticks if you log off or DC in Abyssea zone, to save your time leave the zone instead of logging off there.--Namy 08:33, July 24, 2010 (UTC).

I had this happen as well. reading down this page I noticed one person had there time erased by entering then leaving without visitant status. I know I did this, so that may be what happened to others. ShadowKatze 21:40, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Unable to chain ?
Was in Abyssea - Tahrongi with a 10 man alliance farming Mandies for Humus and we werent getting EXP chains. we were killing them fairly quickly and should have been getting at least chain 5, but werent. anyone else notice this ? or is Odin's Abyssea - Tahrongi broke ? --MIKUMARU 19:30, July 6, 2010 (UTC)

It is not broken. You do not chain exp in there, and EXP rings have no effect either. --Maruraba 02:46, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

I remeber seeing the Corsair's roll and Dedication having no effect but didnt see Chaining mentioned. I suppose it makes sense with the sexy pryxis thingies. --MIKUMARU 16:12, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

in abyssea is a hidden chain on a mob family. the more you kill the more xp you get for each kill and more cruor and chest pop's. if you kill other mobs chain resets (unless you CFH). Mindi 22:54, July 9, 2010 (UTC)

I entered Tahrongi zone, used one stone, checked my cruor and left using the maw. re-entered to drag someone else out without requesting visitant status leaving through the maw again. waited one hour because i couldn't re-enter and when i did re-enter my 28-29 minutes were gone.--Chimeramage 16:58, July 7, 2010 (UTC)

Light, EXP, and You
I ran with an LS EXP Abyssea group tonight with the intent of figuring out how some of the lights work, chest drops, etc. To corroborate what others have noticed (and my past experience has conclusively proven to me), killing with magic earns you azure light, killing with weapon skills earns ruby light, and killing with physical damage earns pearlescent light.

What those three specific lights do is a little unclear to me still. At the very least, when killing a monster with magic often enough, we were getting more azure light messages, and more chests dropped. The chests were more often blue than gold or red, but killing with magic -did not- cause blue chests to drop exclusively. Now, this is pure speculation on my part, but stronger lights of each type could cause their corresponding chests to provide better rewards. The ultimate rewards being 1000 cruor, 1250 exp, the load of temp items, and time extensions from blue chests and the strong silvery, ebon, and golden lights from red chests. I'm assuming augmented items, scrolls, gems, and rare crafting materials are the ultimate rewards from gold chests.

As far as the three lights from red chests go, golden was the one I paid most attention to. After around the 2 1/2 hour mark of our exp run, we seemed to be capped at about 345 exp per kill for a good 5-10 minute stretch, having largely ignored red chests to focus on opening blue chests. When I began opening red chests with golden light, these caps began to raise noticeably. I started using Forbidden Keys on them to easily obtain more golden light (they're very hard to open with a narrow range of 5 or 6 numbers i.e. 14~18 or 22~27). It got to the point where I believe we hit the hard cap of 600 exp per kill, no additional golden light seemed to increase it beyond 600 exp per kill (as seen in screenshots 5 and 6 below).

Screenshots detailing the progression of exp following golden light. Relevant parts of the log are highlighted.       An important note to those that wish to EXP in Abyssea: in order to "chain" to very high EXP amounts, only a single mob type can be killed. Should any other mob or NM be killed, the "chain" is reset back to its base values, along with the "levels" of your light (meaning, chest rewards go back to easy-to-open, but poor rewards).

With all this in mind, I'm gonna go ahead and clean up some of the tags on the light section, because I'm certain that some of the information here and what's already been posted is conclusive enough. Any additional info on what exactly silvery and ebon lights do (I'm assuming one of them affect cruor rates) will clean up the rest of that section.--Mooffins 11:39, July 10, 2010 (UTC)

Light effects have been confirmed so the verification tags can be removed if they are listed correctly --Baelorn 03:42, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

Given that SE's outright told us what the lights do now, can we get that entire "Abyssean Aggro" section struck? While it's possible select mobs may have aggro changes based on the lights, that should go into that family's page and not in the category. Also, could we get Abyssea added to the sidebar directly, instead of having to go through several other pages or a direct search? This page has enough information to warrant a direct link under Endgame now. Tristan Kain 10:27, July 17, 2010 (UTC)

Weakness Discussion
This section is completely speculative and is also incorrect. It should be removed. You don't collect data on a main page of a wiki. You collect it on the discussion page. The data available now indicates that the triggers rotate all the time, so this table could be completely worthless. --Ringthree 16:37, July 14, 2010 (UTC)

or it could be moved to the mob pages where most would be looking for that type of information, and noted that it could change at any time. also see this --Icari 16:45, July 14, 2010 (UTC)

Echoing Ringthree's comment. Add to that the fact that of the first entries on the table, Tachi: Gekko is listed as a magical weapon skill, when it most certainly is not. Too little is known about what possible triggers there are to have something so definitive. It's even worse when triggers aren't even labeled properly. Inclusion of the table basically says "these are the things that will trigger the ?!" when it could be anything at any time. I understands works-in-progress, but that should be reserved for the discussion.--Mooffins 23:40, July 14, 2010 (UTC)

Ok, I am moving the tables here for now. The information can be added to the individual mob pages, but as of right now they do no appear to actually have any correlation with the specific mobs, so that may be useless too. --Ringthree 15:43, July 15, 2010 (UTC)

Spell weakness might be triggered by element damage or status effect. I noticed Flash on both pulls/first 'voke' of Gancanagh and Tefenet caused, with NIN and RDM Blind-spells causing it on different occasions during the fight as well. --Seedling 08:56, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

I believe the tables should remain here, and be updated as much as possible. Sure, individual mob pages should have them listed, but this will hopefully enable us to look for patterns, if they exist, easier. Krizz 14:55, July 20, 2010 (UTC)

Everytime my group does NMs we hit the weakness with Flash, and Seraph Blade, but not both, a vast majority of the time. This is very unscientific I know, however this strategy has worked a number of times and we have received Atma every time we hit the weakness, when there is Atma to be had. More distinct testing is needed, but those two abilities have worked on a number of mobs in a number of locations. Just thought I would share. -EdwinOfThay 16:18, September 8, 2010 (UTC)

Can anyone show any emperical data that using the weaknesses drastically decreases drop rate for items, or atma. The NPC says nothing about this, and on Lugarhoo, we fought him for 3 hours, getting about 25 kills and each fight we were able to spam blue !!! and still managed to get the drop 2/3 times, so I am not sure there is any basis that spaming a weakness reduces the drop. Id be more inclined to believe it just wasnt 100% to begin with. -- Gilmour

Not sure where to put this, but Regurgitation activated blue !! on Ovni one time (twice in the same fight, so I'm 100% certain that was the trigger). Since then I have never managed to proc a !! with any blue magic spell on any NM, but it's worth noting that blue magic is also on the list... yay... --Blazza 06:44, October 6, 2010 (UTC)

Was just wondering if anyone else has had something similar to this happen, was duoing Pallid Percy a few days ago, I was using blizzard IV throughout the fight, and the yellow !! only triggered off one of them, which was even a resist. There any chance that a certain amount of damage of a certain element might trigger a !!? --DauthiShade October 16, 2010 (UTC)

Here is a fight i did tonight with 2 triggers on same NM. The 1st trigger (Grellow from a Freeze during late Windday) seems in line with the day theory presented above, but the 2nd one (Red from Seraph Blade during early Iceday) i don't understand the relation with the theory...Sorry for the broken image link, some wiki admin considered wiki isnot an image hosting site, and consequently deleted the images.Masamunai, October 15, 2010 (UTC)

More double weaknesses and even triple weaknesses on same NM testimonials in this BlueGartr thread. Just gotta search a bit... but pretty much all so far fits with the element of days before/current/after theory for Red and Grellow "!!" proc'ing. Not the "element of day opposite to current day" theory as claimed by Endlesspath, his testimonials fits btw with the 1st theory lol. Also, since apparently Endlesspath fails to understands Kegsay and Moofins, please post here a link of a single page from wiki having a factual example right on its main page. Also, since when theories are built over ONE SINGLE fact ? Sorry EndlessPath, i was refraining myself till i see other users thinking same as me to put your example in its "right" place, ie the discussion page. I'll end with a last notice: you know there are also banhammers here also, for persons repeatedly not respecting the wikia policies ?Masamunai 08:58, October 24, 2010 (UTC)

Suggestion: anyone have an image of the Vana'days elements order to replace the elemental wheel Endlesspath posted on main page ?Masamunai 09:01, October 24, 2010 (UTC)

Segment deleted as it is now superceded by hhttp://wiki.ffxiclopedia.org/wiki/Weakness_Targeting --Endlesspath 05:36, October 25, 2010 (UTC)

AAaah finally found it ! Was searching where to post a discussion proposal about weakness targeting, and specifically regarding Atmas/Abyssites/KeyItems... A few days ago, i was "completing" the Atma (Status Effect) page... until i discovered there existed another very similar Atma page (category template). So despite feeling "meh did i work for nada ?!", i'm asking here what would be your ideas regarding organisation of those pages/sections talking about Weakness targeting ? My personal opinion would be to merge all with the Abyssea page, with a linking to correct tables for "Atma" "Abyssite" keywords inputted on searchbox.

Also, i think the above tables for weaknesses by NMs is useless, because i think more and more that each NM picks 1st an element from the vanaday it popped (or the element strong against), which determines automatically which EleWSs and Spells will trigger Red and Grellow weaknesses. For example, if a mage triggers grellow !! with Paralyze (Ice), then most probably Red can be triggered with Ice eleWSs (or Dark eleWSs if those are considered "multi-elements" by the game). I don't have data to back this theory, but i'll try to get testimonials of both Red/Grellow triggered on same NM... Last thing i'm wondering about is about Blue Physical/Magical Spells, Avatars' Phys/magical BPs, and Automatons WSs: how can they be classified in terms of weakness triggering ?Masamunai 13:05, October 13, 2010 (UTC)

There is no weight to the theory that the element of the day correlates in any way to the element of a weaponskill or spell that was used. My linkshell has tried cycling through weaponskill and spells and have found no evidence of any sort of correlation between spell/weaponskill to day of popping the NM. There is no theory that should be up on what triggers weaknesses right now. As far as everyone labeling their experiences as “factual” and others as “opinions” that needs to go out the window. How about this, empirical evidence. In other words, if someone has a screenshot of a weakness triggering a !! cool. Let’s post that. But there is certainly no reason to even have one theory up on the main page yet because there is simply not enough verified data (e.g. screenshots). So for anyone to start accusing anyone else of their theories as opinions is just wrong. It’s just unverified. Nothing more, nothing less. Another thing that needs to be done is falsifying. For anyone who doesn't know, falsifying just means that you're trying to find ways that you can disprove a given theory. The goal there is to find out what the truth is, not just proving the other guy wrong. This is absolutely essential with regards to testing theories. If you only try to test one theory, and not others, you’re falling victim to confirmation bias. http://www.ukskeptics.com/explanation.php?dir=articles/explanations&article=confirmation_bias.php I cannot stress this point enough. You have to test everyone’s theories if you’re actually being unbiased. If someone comes up with evidence that disproves a theory, you have to take that into account and modify the current theory or come up with a new one entirely. Equinox78

Your linkshell maybe didnot find any correlation, but thousand of other on all servers did:. Sorry i should have posted this link earlier... and i bet there should also be a similar strong thread on Allakhazam too. Masamunai 09:50, October 24, 2010 (UTC)

Do you know what burden of proof, positive and negative evidence, and confirmation bias are? I've looked over that link and although they may have found a correlation, that is not conclusive. I say this because I've seen a weakness trigger on iceday from water threnody. I don't expect anyone to just take my word on the matter, but what I'm saying is that it still warrants further investigation. Again, please look up those 3 concepts, especially the one about confirmation bias. Equinox78

Regarding those 3 concepts, i think i misphrased: yes i'm aware a single testimonial can destroy a theory, but from my experience (irl and ig), in 90% of cases that single testimonial is often flawed. That could mean, for example since i didnot experienced it, you claimed NM during the day before Iceday (Windday), then fight continued during iceday and you triggered with water threnody. In this case, yellow "!!" would be triggered with a randomed spell whose element is either Water/Wind/Ice.... np with Water threnody. The weakness element is chosen from the day NM is claimed, and stays the same through the fight, even if current day changes. On other hand, from testimonials on this BG thread, i'm still confused regarding Red "!!" and eleWSs' properties (element or skillchain elements?), especially if Lightday and/or Darkday come into play...Masamunai 22:38, October 24, 2010 (UTC)

I'm not flawed. I also don't expect you to take my word for it either. I just don't have any screenshots to back it up. It's what's called -unverified-. It's worth everyone's time to keep an open mind and keep testing different different weaponskills and spells. Did you check out that link on confirmation bias AND make sure you understood it? I cannot stress that point enough. You have to make sure you're not falling victim to confirmation bias before you can say that other testimonials are flawed. Equinox78

Sorry to chime in here Equinox78, but Water Threnody is lightning-based, which is the day after Iceday. Perhaps you should have checked that before. Kegsay 11:21, October 25, 2010 (UTC)

Ditto on the Water Threnody. It's lightning element, so it still fits predictions made by the "day of the week" theory. Thundersday follows Iceday.--Mooffins 17:42, October 25, 2010 (UTC)

WEAKNESS DATA CAPTURE FORM--Endlesspath 05:36, October 25, 2010 (UTC)

Notes:
 * Player that achieved [[Image:Weakness_Blue.png]] subsequently ko'd and hp'd, then returned.. still had top item drops (vari helm & Charis neck).

'Reference charts listed below for comparative analysis of data captured on form above' DAY OF GAME WEEK sequence --> -->  -->  -->  -->  -->  -->

A good mnemonic for remembering the order is: FEW WILL Die.

Weakness Blue Trigger and Vanadiel Time
Just figured out a few slashing time/weapon that will proc the blue trigger. Just pay attention that this time is the time you pulled a timed NM or poped a forced NM.

Katana blue proc between Vanadiel time 17:00 and 17:59 Great Axe blue proc between Vanadiel time 19:00 and 19:59 Axe blue proc between Vandiel time 21:00 and 21:59 Great Katana blue proc between Vanadiel time 18:00 and 18:59 All tests in Abyssea-Altepa on the same Notorious Monster (Ansherekh) Sephirothknight

Wouldnot it better to list on the chart above only Double/Triple weaknesses on same NM ? Most single weakness patterns are covered i think ? Double/Triple would help more checking for correlations, especially between Red and Yellow patterns. Also i'm having more and more doubts regarding the "Greatly Enhances droprate" of Yellow "!!": from all the Yellow triggers i got, only ONE NM gave us HQ drops (4 seals)...Masamunai 07:46, October 31, 2010 (UTC)

Sound a good idea to me, could already get 30+ lines filled with the testimonials from the BG thread. One suggestion tough: i wouldnot mix together Moon Phase and Time(of trigger?) into the same column as claim vanaday, since the 1st is just a theory thrown around the BG thread very recently and i don't even know for which weakness; and 2nd is related mostly to the Blue weakness. Other reason is also you can't trigger 2 different "!!" at same time. EDIT: nvm, your format is correct, forget my comment, what i suggested above was actually same mistake as Equinox thinking weakness change with current day through the fight... Oh!! i just realized i missed an important sentence Endlesspath bolded: No, no and again no, factual infos don't and will never belongs to ANY main page ! just look around whole wikipedia and show one example. Such table should always stays on Discussion page, as Kegsay & Moofins already said above.Masamunai 07:37, October 25, 2010 (UTC)

Endlesspath: I think compiling data is a great idea. I also think its important that we have some way that its verified like a screenshot before we add it to a table. Masamuni: I have not advocated one theory yet. What I've stated over and over is that we shouldn't be promoting one theory on the wiki page yet. And if you really want to say that's my position, please provide a verbatim quote. Thanks! :D Equinox78

Agreed with Equinox ^^. Also Mea Culpa too i failed to see the Lightning element of water threnody lol. Regarding current theories, i feel me too there are things that merits some attention: a) Red !! : Relationship between the Before/Current/Next day's element and WHICH PROPERTY of the currently reported Elemental WSs, their damage element, or their skillchain properties, or something else ? b) A lot of poeple still confused with the "current day" notion, like reporting day when they triggered while the NM has been claimed the day before < <. Maybe should specify somewhere that the weakness the NM picks on claim or pop never changes through the fight ? c) Looks like 99% of poeple understanding current weakness theories thinks gotta bring as much jobs as possible to cover as much weaknesses as possible to a NM fight. But Noone ever suggested if NM simply picks its weaknesses from jobs "available in claiming alliance". I saw a few duoing poeple triggering 100% of the time, even tough they are far from covering ALL possible weaknesses. In the same topic, do spells/WSs from subjobs picked too when NM randomly choose its weaknesses? d) How about Automatons/BST pets or jugs/Avatars WSs or BPs ? Can they trigger anything ? Those 4 points still needs further investigation.Masamunai 09:46, October 26, 2010 (UTC) e) Couple comments: Re: red !!; I at times could swear that achieving the red !! is actually relative to the moment (actual game time) of use, vs time of pop/claim.... reason why I say that is that you'll note the a fair amount of the red !! achieved on the chart near end of game day doesnt seem to match up with current theories consistently (I may have to add 'actual game day red !! achieved column). 2) Also while on 4 person exp/chest farming run I was 85 bst... I could swear that pet can get pearly lights at least.. seemed to occur about as consistently as PC getting pearly's.--Endlesspath 20:19, November 1, 2010 (UTC)

Added new data to weakness chart, Tachi: Koki lit up Red !! during Lightsday. I haven't looked into it too much, but I have noticed that there's a lack of Water Elemental WS (correct me if I'm wrong, and sorry ahead of time if there is) but with that in mind, perhaps it's the day of the week that corresponds with or contrasts the WS? (ex: Tachi: Koki being able to pop on either Light or Darksday or Cyclone opening weakness on Wind or Waters.) Further proof is the Dark WS Shadow of Death proc'ing on Lightsday. However, since Lightsday is followed by Darks, it could also be the current/previous/following day element theory again... Damn too many unproven theories!

Another question, however. When it's said that the day for Yellow !!, it says popped claimed etc., does this count another party, even if they wipe, or when it turns red for your party? --Monjula

Re: Monjula's question - popped/claimed specifically pertains to the as far as the data capture chart is concerned; on the other hand the  and  appear to be very specifically tied to the day and game time moment of spell/ws use. Finally I would say that observation of the and  from outside the claiming party/ally still can be entered for data capture; tho honestly the main mystery of concern for the chart is the  (In which case you should be in the claiming party/ally for data capture purposes even if there is a wipe on same).

Been following threads on multiple sites for a while now and I currently run an abyssea ls on Sylph. I have no screenshots to back this up but so far my experience that there is no connection between game day pop and specific elemental ws's triggering a red !! it appears completely random. I will agree to the grellow !! trigger connection to the day theory as plausible but still needs more verification. Also triggering a grellow !! enhancing drop rates is just false. Only times i've seen top drops is from blue !!'s and never a grellow !! Honestly I'd like to see less bickering here between people with different theories and more facts with verification. The table listing elemental ws's that trigger a red !! is correct and is limited to only those ws's triggering it, I think the same is true of the physical ws's that trigger a blue !! perhaps we could get some people to test this out and get some input back to us and if no one noticed all the ws's listed in the chart above are all multi-hit ws's which may or may not be something but I think it's atleast worth looking into.

I want to know why people think that because a ws is quested it doesnt work. I personally have triggered red with primal rend and had it confirmed from another bst who has also triggered red on a different mob with his primal rend. IT DOES WORK! I have also triggered blue with bora axe confirmed by other people seeing it. Why the hell are people removing these from the main abyssea page? These weapon skill are confirmed what more do you want?

"Max effects" determination from lights
Hi guys, today I was doing Abyssea - Tahrongi and we maxed out azure light first. I asked my group how one could determine that and they said that it could be determined from 1k Cruor or 1250 experience given from blue chests. I decided to add this little note to the wiki page, and I would like to request that 1) It be verified and 2) max effect determinations be added for other lights. Thanks! Raxiaz 20:43, July 16, 2010 (UTC)

i understand that max Cruor you can get is 1k and max exp is 1250, but does anyone know for fact that if as soon you reach that the TE box start to appear? if yes then it means that's indeed the "limit" for Azure, if no then it simply mean that TE is the next tier, also need to compare the restore box as well in comparison with TE drops, i have conformed that with very high Azure you can get 100% 2hrs reset, i went 9/9 as smn and spammed Odin using it (also went 9/9 on KO) --Namy 08:39, July 24, 2010 (UTC).

As I understand it, there's a "tier" of azure light which sometimes gives 1000 EXP and sometimes 1250 EXP (not sure about how much cruor that tier gives), while the tier after that always gives 1250 EXP. I don't think the "sometimes 1250 EXP" tier can give time extensions, but I'm not entirely sure. --Isilien 03:33, August 2, 2010 (UTC)

Chest opener role for exp groups
One person in the group needs to open the treasure chests. The designated box opener should spend about 20,000 cruor on forbidden keys, which take a few minutes to purchase one at a time from the cruor prospector. After about an hour with a typical group that has farmed lights properly, you will have very little time to do anything but open the chests. To conserve your forbidden keys, you can play the number games until you have made two wrong guesses on blue chests or are on your last attempt on red chests. At that point you can decide if it's worth using a forbidden key (peek into the box if you haven't already). Curor, exp, and familiar stone fragments are usually worth keys. Sometimes it's worth using keys on red chests to speed up the group's light bonuses, or even on numerous temp items to speed up kills. More advanced groups may want you to announce the intense soothing light blue boxes for other jobs so they can use keys and reset their 2hours. They may also want you to avoid building certain lights, such as avoiding ruby lights but wanting amber lights. Discuss with your group beforehand on how to handle items from the golden boxes. If the group wants to random for items, you might need another person to handle the /randoms and distributing. Really bad augmented items can be sold to npcs and can cover the box opener's curor loss. If the target mob doesn't do any nasty AOE damage, you can level a job as low as 30. It might be more useful to help kill mobs during the first hour of low light bonuses, though.

Data gathering on lights and boxes
i need people to note effects of number of kills of a certain lights and when do the changes occur, as after x amount of lights + y amount of z power box i got this box with this power. i hope we be able to make a table for how many kills (light power) required before reaching a certain point of required boxes power (like when to reach TE for example). --Namy 08:50, July 24, 2010 (UTC).

-I would like people to also see a re-verification that changing mobs makes you loose light or exp or reset chain. In fact, I've gone from capped leveling on lizards, used Conflux, and went to fight tonberrys and kept all capped stats. Exp capped from first tonberry kill at 630, and chests were capped.--Kuraichi1 03:38, September 13, 2010 (UTC)

Abyssean Aggro

 * Verification Needed  See  Discussion Page.
 * Monsters in Abyssea start out as aggressive, but grow more and more resentful towards adventurers slaying their Abyssean kin. One does not even have to kill that family to gain their resentment. One could kill a dozen lizards, and earn the ire of Efts.
 * This aggression might be linked to the 'lights' messages. After killing an enemy, sometimes a message tells you the player's body shines with a certain light.
 * Cruor reward for the next mob that aggros due to lights is increased. (As much as x6 bonus, if not more, but it resets once 'spent'.)
 * feeble azure : Causes Gulch Limule to aggro.
 * faint pearlescent : Causes ??? to aggro.
 * faint ruby : Causes Jaguarundi to aggro.

This is all Untrue, this has been tested after killing Mandy's for up to 9hrs and accumulating Maximum amount of light in all Tiers. Gulch Limule Aggro to Low HP and Jaguarundi Aggro to Sight no matter how little or much Light you have. As for ??? aggro this is just a laughable conclusion as these are spawned with Key Items, Rare, or Exclusive drops from there particular Family inside Abyssea.

Moved this section here from main article, as it's really old information of questionable accuracy. When/if it gets verified, it's here, so that it can be easily copied back. --Katrel 15:30, July 26, 2010 (UTC)

Abysseans have strange aggro patterns. during a run in Abyssea - Konschtat running by the Dybbuk with sneak up caused a massive train. they even came from beyond sightline. we ran by Ypotryll with sneak up with np ,, but goin by under the effects of a Sprinter's Drink made it like sneak and invisible werent even up. ==MIKUMARU 00:10, July 28, 2010 (UTC)

The main article says: Yesterday I was in Abyssea-Konschtat running around activating confluxes when someone in the party aggroed a bugard, which I provoked. Ran to the nearest conflux (which was faaaaar away from the entrance to the zone, can't remember the number for now) and warped to #1. Refilled HP at the martello outside the main camp, and then waited for the others to raise up and whatnot. Sat there for probably 10 minutes, when suddenly the bugard ran in there and brutally killed me. Now this may not be true for all mob types or under all circumstances, such as not having taken any action on the mob, so I'm not sure whether to remove it from the main article or if it just needs to be changed, and in that case WHAT it needs to be changed to, but using confluxes definitely isn't a "fair escape"! --Isilien 03:23, August 2, 2010 (UTC) Actually, I'll just remove it for now... Since obviously it isn't true (in all cases). If new information is found that can just be added in later. --Isilien 09:12, August 2, 2010 (UTC)
 * 1) Using a Veridical Conflux will grant fair escape, like zoning.Verification Needed

Pearlescent lights
I was noticing that even if the mob was killed with a melee attack, the exp group was not getting the pearlescent light. I switched to a melee job and noticed when I killed it with 89 damage melee hit it did not give the pearlescent light, however when I killed the mob with a 108 damage hit, it did. Much more testing needed but I believe that pearlescent light has a damage minimum for the killshot. I stuck the heavy 2handers on the mobs for the kill and built our pearlescent lights in notime. Can anyone else verify this too? --Eiryn 14:47, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

I have notice strange things with pearl lights too we went nearly 90mins without seeing a single pearl light with a party made up of alot of low dmg hitters and lv75's. Have been in with lv77-80 and got to 20+ pearl within 30mins but next time with lower lv ppl taking up to 45-50mins to get 20 lights. It maybe all lights have a dmg min but with ws and nukes you rarely see one for < 100. --Jamiegraham8210 16:34, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

In the second run I've 'commanded,' I also noticed some oddities trying to get Ruby light. We had plenty of heavy-hitting DD but I did notice Pearlescent light not showing on every kill while trying to build up the chest drop-rate. Once Pearl and Azure were 'capped' we began trying to kill with weaponskills for Ruby but hardly received any messages about Ruby light. I think I saw 2 out of probably 45 minutes. HOWEVER, we did still receive a few red chests with Ebon light, so either that is still a random light attainable at levels under 'Ruby cap' or you can still gain light without seeing a message about it. DiabloRojo 18:03, July 27, 2010 (UTC)

I'm a BLM, and we had finished going for Azure lights, and were focusing on Pearl lights. To that end, I took out my staff and whacked the mob a lot. I did get one kill. We got the Pearl light for my kill. I guarantee you, my BLM staff did not do very much damage. -- 20:11, August 25, 2010 (UTC)

red chests
It feels like each click is worth 10 pressure but the value has a range based on the noise message. Good nick, faintly audible, rattles fitfully, point of eeriness seem to be from smallest variance to highest variance but more data should be collected. the sound of air escaping is faintly audible down 1: 13, 18, 13, 17, 16, 12, 20 down 2: 23, 28 down 3: 35, 37, 38, 36, 32, 32, 39, 31, 37 up 1: 18 up 2: up 3: the mechanism is silent to the point of eeriness down 1: 20, 22, 23, 13, 30, 36 down 2: 39, 25, 34 down 3: 49, 57, 52, 57, 58, 31, 60 up 1: 10 up 2: up 3: The mechanism appears to be in good nick down 1: 10 down 2: down 3: 30, 30, 31, 33, 31, 32, 30 up 1: up 2: 21 up 3: The mechanism's adjuster lever rattles fitfully down 1: 22, 20, 10, 11, 23, 23 down 2: 21 down 3: 39, 38, 45, 30 up 1: up 2: up 3:

How many Stones can Joachim build up?
Like in assault ID Tags, Joachim builds up Stones. You can do abyssea use up all your stones then go back to him for up to 5 new, use them and come back for more. I know that he stores at least 6 stones. Does anybody know the maximum he stores? 10? 20? 99? --Nomido 12:11, August 8, 2010 (UTC)

There is no max number he will hold, or better yet there is no known max number. As of now every 20hr(16hrs or 12hrs with certain Key Items) he will hold another stone up to infinite. --Boner 03:46 August 16, 2010 (UTC)

I am at 97 right now. I'll log in later to see if it goes past 100. Littledarc 01:52, October 25, 2010 (UTC)

I've had almost 120. --Chieka 17:00, October 27, 2010 (UTC)

Last I looked, I had 310 stones. :)

Abyssite Layout
Can someone do something to add a small separator to each category of abyssite (i.e. ivory, scarlet, etc.) to make the list easier to read? --Vegetatheprince 20:19, September 8, 2010 (UTC)

Exp Chains No Longer Instantly Resetting?
Discovered very unusual exp behaviour while burning through excess time after an exp party in Tahrongi[A]. While the first Bhumi kill for the three of us who stayed behind gave massive amounts of exp as expected as an odd form of chain closer (such behaviour is already known), so did the seven or eight other ones we killed that night (1k, 1500, or 2k, apparently dependent on size as usual). So too did the several Ephemeral opponents we killed (1k each). It might be argued that Ephemeral enemies and Avatars have a limited effect on the chain, but we also killed four Limules that aggroed us with no apparent negative effect, and we killed a Pachypodium just to see if the bonus was still remotely intact (still well over 300 each, 450ish for the longest-duration person there), only to get another 1500 on the next Bhumi. Either a) the family chain bonus is no longer instantly reset for killing something out-of-order; or b) the various lights also boost minimum exp/kill instead of just maximum. I know there's probably more logical explanations than those, I just can't think of them offhand. Given what this could mean for exp groups and NM hunters, verification -desperately- requested. Tristan Kain 22:20, September 12, 2010 (UTC)

Gold light resets, kill count doesn't. FFXIFlux 21:01, October 15, 2010 (UTC)

This is also wrong, the chain resets but not the gold lights. - The Yellow !! Weakness chart states it is aligned in order of Vana diel days...this is incorrect. Days run: Fire, Earth, Water, Wind, Ice, Lightning, Light, Dark

--Izzybella 15:27, October 23, 2010 (UTC)
 * It's been fixed. Thanks for the heads up.--Mooffins 17:05, October 24, 2010 (UTC)

Banishga II triggered !! Weakness on Pallid Percey while popped on Darksday. Removed Verification Tag

Screenshot Question
Just wondering if anyone else noticed but the screens for the visions zones are 1/3 showing the actual "Boss" for the area. While the Scars zones have 3/3 for the bosses in their area. Bosses meaning the NM thats required defeat in order to trigger the CS for each zone upon exiting. Just a thought ^^ Zetsugan 22:45, October 31, 2010 (UTC)

Removed from the article
I removed the following text from the article, first because it was in the "Experience" section although it doesn't talk about experience at all, and second because it's poorly written and isn't very accurate (I'm not BST but I don't see why a weaponskill - Primal Rend - would give Azure Light. It should give Amber Light like Aeolian Edge since it's elemental, or else it would give ruby light like all the other weaponskills (including Flaming Arrow if I remember correctly, although it does fire elemental damage). --Soily 13:22, November 2, 2010 (UTC)


 * Special advice for capping Time Extension's lights for the purpose of seal farming:
 * Set your seal farming team to a max of 4 people, have at least 2 jobs that can do azure light kills (e.g., Blm/Sch/Rdm elemental magic, Bst>Primal Rend, Blu>physical/magic attks). << Reason for # cap of 4 is that repops stay no higher than t (fast kills), vt+ take too long to kill.
 * Use the Ephemeral Monsters as your primary targets due to the Azure light bonus (up to 10x ).
 * Enjoy your time to do some seal farming presuming you've a competent mix of jobs appropriate for the type nms you are seal farming!

Advertisement Blurbs
Is it really necessary to have the advertisement blurbs for abyssea at the very top of the page? They provide no real information, and just cause everything else to be pushed down further, so it's necessary to scroll the page down in order to access anything useful. Ayria 01:08, November 20, 2010 (UTC)
 * I feel they are the only thing that should be on the Category page. Everything else needs organizing. It's getting too bulky. I'm looking into organizing it all. Refer to the top section, ARTICLE IS BEING ABUSED, for more. 14:03, November 23, 2010 (UTC)

I agree with Abbydon. A lot, if not most of it, is more like a guide now. 09:50, November 25, 2010 (UTC)

Revert/fix Red !! Weakness section
I find the "Red !! Weakness" by element completely unnecessary, and now the section format is broken. Either a revert to the last version before this edit or an omission + fix would be lovely, unless there is any explanation behind why we specifically would want to know these weaknesses by element on the actual page itself. As far as people have been concerned, it is random. I don't know what is particularly wrong with the code, but now the "Yellow !! Weakness" section is misplaced inside the "Red !! Weakness" section. Aenanai 20:34, December 24, 2010 (UTC) Edit: Nevermind, fixed it.
 * I agree. As far as anyone can tell, it's random. In any case, the weakness can easily be discerned with the right abyssite, so gathering data is just a waste of time. I support removing the weaknesses section. Mifaco 09:32, December 27, 2010 (UTC)
 * Well, it helps to only have the applicable weapon skills listed somewhere, especially as not all groups will necessarily have the discernment abyssite as of yet. I realize it'll help in case players receive a vague "darkness," "light," etc. notice and not know what WSes they're missing, now that I realize that's what it's for. --Aenanai 19:01, December 28, 2010 (UTC)

Blue Spell Seedspray vs. Bad Breath
Pls stop reverting the earthday spell back to Seedspray which is PHYSICAL! It CAN not be the trigger! From all I know the spell to use it Bad Breath. Aphugel 21:14, January 1, 2011 (UTC) It IS SEEDSPRAY! Stop changing it to badbreath! I don't care if its physical. SEEDSPRAY is the trigger, not badbreath. --MoveZig 05:37, January 3, 2011 (UTC)

Confirmed tonight that Seedspray is indeed a valid trigger. I cannot say for certain whether Bad Breath is a trigger or not, but Seedspray was definitely and without any question whatsoever our yellow trigger tonight.--Ozzymandeus 06:14, January 3, 2011 (UTC)

I also thought Seedspray was a mistake first time I saw it, but I have actually seen it proc yellow. Will screenshot for proof next time it happens. -- 21:37, January 6, 2011 (UTC)

I have made the initial change: Category:Abyssea is now a true category, while :Abyssea is the actual page. --SimuAndy 20:09, January 10, 2011 (UTC)

Do not remove the comments others on a talk page. I restored them and added yours. --Ahkvan 05:01, January 11, 2011 (UTC)